Doctor Who geekery the second

[elionwyr]

Things not said before, and then stuff about the finale part ii:

I find it fascinating that the show has created a special that features the Companions.
I'm also fascinated that, indeed, his Companions *are* soldiers. With hearts, of course, but still soldiers. With so many of them in the past being victims, this is...fabulous.

Ok, so. Watched "Journeys End".

As an Old School Whovian, this episode delighted me because it answered SO many questions. Is the Doctor part human, as has been theorized since the first episode that featured his granddaughter, Susan?
No.

Is he a being that is able to have a full blown romantic relationship with a human?
Apparently not.
(Though I've yet to see all of "Silence in the Library"/"Forest of the Dead" so I don't really know much about River yet....and I'm curious, of course, because maybe she will change my mind yet again about how his hearts work.)

I love the way that the Companions go from being freaked out terrified of the Daleks to all basically shouting "HELL NO!!!!" at them. Great stuff.

I agree with you, rm, about why Jack acts the way he does towards Donna.

Gods, I love Donna. Her departure just shattered me...and I loved DoctorDonna. And as Old School goes, it was fabulous to see a female Doctor....Sorta. Yes, quite a lot like Rose connecting with the TARDIS, and I get why Donna had to not be allowed to be a hybrid, but what a fascinating idea.

I love her grandfather.
I still want to slap her mother.

Keeping in mind I truly do love this episode...

* Davros/the Daleks.... Waaaaaay too much Star Wars stuff going on. He's a mad scientist. I have huge amounts of trouble with him suddenly being The Emperor.

* Hauling the Earth back to its rightful location...Wow, my brain just couldn't buy it. Sorry, nope, no. (As one friend would say, "THIS is the plot point you have a problem with?" Yupperz.)

* Really have difficulty believing the Daleks would honestly want to be rulers of a universe - of all universes - where there are no planets. No other life forms? Sure. But to be rulers of nothing? Where the heck is the fun in THAT?

* And if the worlds are ending?
I have a hard time accepting the Master would not be there to say something.
(Not that I really want to see the current version of the Master again.)

* Did the Doctor lose a regeneration?
I have some big problems with how many lives we've gone through as it is. I'm not convinced that human-Doctor doesn't count as Doctor #11.

* As much fun as the human version of the Doctor was...yeeeeeah, had a problem with that too. It's a brilliant (and tragic) solution to the Rose storyline, and...will he ever really be over her? Will the human version ever really be enough to make her forget? Could it? I really don't know.
I have some trouble with Rose being sent back AGAIN into a world that is not her own, against her wishes and will. She'll do it, because he tells her to, and because she loves him, and she knows that yes, his human version needs to be locked away, far away, from the Doctor. But. But but but. I think Rose deserves better.

Comments

[wolfchylde.livejournal.com]

Actually if you've been keeping tabs on the BBC interviews, both Russel Davies AND David Moffat have said that the whole '13 Regeneration Limit' went out the window when Gallifrey went kablooey. All bets are off as to how many regenerations he has, and in fact it's been stated that the Universe might not let there NOT be a Doctor in it ;)

And I LOVED the latest incarnation(s) of the Master, and they can keep cycling bad guys through him endlessly now :D

[elionwyr.livejournal.com]

Eh. I've heard that, but it really really bothers me that they'd throw that HUGE bit of canon fact out the window.

[ysobelle.livejournal.com]

Apparently, Gallifrey brought the Master back to fight in the Time War, so the regeneration limit is something imposed by the homeworld. No homeworld, no limit. And seriously, can you see the Beeb swallowing that? "You want to kill our best show ever? Not just no, but BLOODY HELL NO!"

Russell Davies implied that River knew more than one incarnation of the Doctor. So it's almost a sure thing we'll see her again at some point. But...well, shoot me, but I think Rose got utterly shafted. There was apparently a scene that got cut from the script wherein 10 gives 10.5 a piece of coral so he can grow a new TARDIS. But that won't make him 10. And that's who Rose loves. Might she grow to love 10.5? Yes. They're virtually the same person, and he's free to tell her he loves her. But it's not a choice she made freely. And it also sucks for 10.

But as I've said before, don't ever forget a Whoniverse character-- you'll see them again later. You know who shows up in one of the '09 specials, right?

[elionwyr.livejournal.com]

re: killing their best show

I confess to having a very bad moment of "this is a great episode, sorta...like...um...."Survival" was...oh, shit!"

re: regeneration
Has anyone ever really investigated what regeneration is? Is it genetic? Are Timelords tinkered with in some mechanical way at a certain time - the regeneration chip, or some such thing? Is it an energy thing like Superman and his wicked crazy power when he's in the right sort of sunlight? Is it somehow tied into the whole 'well, the Master is bonkers because of what happened when he looked into the funky vortex thing as a child and got his new name' thing?

I really dislike the idea of chopping up what is canon for the series. And heck, one of the things that made the Master interesting was how he dealt with his raging against death.

re: Rose
No, I agree. While I love that she finally got her answer and her kiss, I have issues with how she wasn't really given a choice for her future. Again. And she's changed so much and fought so hard.

Do you think 10 would want 10.5 to have a TARDIS of his own? Would he trust him? Or would it be another 'you have a choice' thing?



I also forgot to mention how much I ***LOVED*** seeing 6 people piloting the TARDIS. Has that ever happened before? I can't recall if it did on Gallifrey..

re: '09 special appearance
Um. I've heard a rumour that Tom B might, but..I have a hard time believing it...

[ysobelle.livejournal.com]

ysobelle wrote:
Jul. 29th, 2008 04:32 pm (local)
I think Russell T Davies and Steven Moffat debated the idea a bit, but the history of regeneration is a bit fuzzy. Mainly cos I'm not sure anyone ever thought the show would still be around 45 years later to hit that point. The implication was that it was a social construct from Gallifrey. I'm not sure it was ever explained more deeply than that. And remember, the Doctor looked into the Time Vortex, too. He didn't go nuts. Well, not murderously so.

The only other way of looking at Rose is that 10 truly believes she's the only one with whom he can entrust 10.5. And if you go back and watch 9 again, he really is a much harsher, more violent, grief-stricken Doctor. I'm not sure how 10.5 has started from that point again, unless it's because he has some of Donna's...er...more strident notes woven into his personal harmonics. But still, 10 promised Rose he'd never leave her like that ("School Reunion"). Ooops.

I'd like to think 10 would trust 10.5 with a TARDIS. And remember, there IS one in the alternate universe: it's what fueled the primitive time machine that shot Donna through to her own death in "Turn Left." It has to still exist somewhere, right? And if 10.5 has Rose with him, I'd think 10 would think the TARDIS a decent risk.

As for piloting it, no, it's never been seen before. In fact, when 10 tells everyone that it's meant to be piloted by six Time Lords, it's the first time that's ever been explicitly revealed. Supposedly. Though it makes eminent sense given its architecture. And, as the Doctor himself says, the ridiculous gyrations he has to go through to go out for milk.

Yes, Tom Baker has apparently been in talks to come back, but it might all come to naught. It'd be interesting! But that's not who I meant. Someone else. Someone we'd expected to see again.

And now that you're caught up, so to speak, are you going to come join us?

http://community.livejournal.com/childrenoftime/

[elionwyr.livejournal.com]

Oo..just joined!

re: 9 VS 10
Oh, the change is inarguable. Even 10's change in this regeneration. I don't think 9 would have tried to save Davros..

re: 10 VS 10.5
I get what you're saying.
I think my problem is that it feels like 10 is 'banishing' 10.5, and so I'm not sure he'd give him a TARDIS. And what happens when 10.5 passes away..?

re: regeneration
Ok, this clicks better in my head. If the Timelords are self-regulating themselves somehow, then they can't be omnipotent eternal creatures.

I think if it was a matter of choice, though, that...well. I wonder how the Master's struggle to continue past 13 lives fits into that theory?